[Phono-L] Zonophone Grand Opera Questions

[Andrew Baron]

Thanks, Jeff for your reply.  Is there any specific information  
available at all about the month or dates in 1904 in which Victor  
acquired Zonophone?

The paper on the bottom of the cabinet appears to have an Oct 1st 1903  
printing form date, and a hand-written serial number (9502).  The  
serial number on the reproducer is 6768, and the lettering behind the  
diaphragm reads: "*ZONOPHONE* UNIVERSAL TALKING MACHINE MFG. CO.  NY",  
and in the smaller lettering of the inner circle: "PAT. IN U.S. &  
FOREIGN COUNTRIES", and "MANUFACTURED EXCLUSIVELY BY".

As much as I would prize owning the iconic beveled glass version of a  
Grand Opera, this one is a factory rear-mount machine, which makes it  
interesting in its own right since they seem to be so much scarcer.   
Therefore the sound box isn't a long-throat type since it's mounted at  
the end of a tone arm.  Would a rear-mount version ever have been  
equipped with the Concert-V or some variant of it?

This Grand Opera must have been made around the time of the Victor  
acquisition or shortly thereafter, before the Zonophones were restyled  
more similar to Victor machines.  It has the deeply embossed Universal  
top plate and all the classic Zonophone features, as outlined in my  
first inquiry.  The top plate has a slot for accommodating a front- 
mount bracket.

It's likely that it had been with the same family since new or nearly  
new.  Based on this, my assumption is that it was an unsold older  
model at the time of its eventual first-time sale, and may have been a  
couple years old at that time as evidenced by the horn, which is not  
only rear mount as noted above, but petaled (11 panels).  As with pre- 
Victor Zonophones in general, the horn is all brass including the elbow.

My friend whom I acquired the machine from recalls clearly that this  
horn was on it when he first saw the machine in the early '30s, so my  
assumption has been that if the horn was on the machine when it was  
first sold, the year of sale must have been around 1905, near the  
beginning of petaled horn production, and the horn may have been  
installed to prior to its first sale, perhaps replacing a more  
traditional brass-bell & conical body horn, to make the machine appear  
more up to date.

I would like to get more insight into this machine and its probably  
history, and hear from anyone who either agrees with my unscientific  
assumptions, or has some additional information that would help me to  
more accurately reconstruct the circumstances around its origins.

Best regards,
Andy Baron
Santa Fe


On Jul 15, 2009, at 7:56 AM, Jeffry Young, D.O. wrote:


> I know that Victor acquired Zonophone in 1904. The Zonophone  
> Exhibition
> Style long throat reproducer would have been contemporaneous to the
> Victor version. So..., the question is when was this first used by
> Victor? The Zonophone version would have been considered an upgrade  
> from
> the Concert-V. Your machine would have been sold with the Concert-V.
> There is no doubt that there is better sound quality with the  
> Zonophone
> Exhibition Style reproducer.
>
> So, the best answer that I can give you is that the Zonophone  
> Exhibition
> Style reproducer would have been used after 1904. It is possible that
> the original owner upgraded at the point of purchase, or at a later
> date. Do you have a paper label on the bottom of your case? There  
> may be
> a production date.
>
> Any other Zono collectors out there with any thoughts on this  
> question?
>
> Jeff
> Wisconsin
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: phono-l-bounces at oldcrank.org [mailto:phono-l-bounces at oldcrank.org 
> ]
> On Behalf Of Andrew Baron
> Sent: Tuesday, July 14, 2009 12:53 PM
> To: Antique Phonograph List
> Subject: [Phono-L] Zonophone Question - This one makes me a little
> nervous!
>
> Does anyone know when the Concert V gave way to the later style
> (similar to the Victor Exhibition) reproducer with the red lettering?
>
> I would love to be able to narrow down the likely date of production
> of my Grand Opera, which has the later type of reproducer (although
> the cabinet is purely traditional Zonophone style with the embossed
> metal top plate, S-shaped crank, Zonophone type motor, etc).
>
> I have provenance on this machine back to the early '30s, and it's
> known that this late style reproducer was on the machine then, so it's
> likely that it's been with it since new or nearly new.
>
> Thanks in advance for any insight whatsoever, even if it's a rough
> estimate of that time frame.
>
> Andy Baron
> Santa Fe
>
>
> On Jul 14, 2009, at 10:52 AM, Jeffry Young, D.O. wrote:
>
>> John,
>>
>> You are correct! I have seen these pictures before! If you had not
>> found
>> this, you can easily tell that the horn is not polished in the added
>> pictures. Also, the reproducer is the later Exhibition style  
>> Zonophone
>> red faced reproducer, not the Concert-V that is in the original
>> picture.
>>
>>
>> The original picture looks like one of "firebottles" zonophone  
>> auction
>> pictures?
>>
>> So..., who is the expert at reporting fraud to ebay? How does one do
>> this. There are already 3 bidders?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Jeff
>> Wisconsin
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